Hacker Newsnew | past | comments | ask | show | jobs | submitlogin

> I'm no fan of imperialism or the military, but I think it is possible for a self-interested nation to treat its own citizens well while acting immorally abroad.

Is there a historical example of it though? I am not exactly a history buff, but so far I am drawing blanks. And I have trouble imagining it in theory, even; I mean sure, a person could theoretically be very dishonest to one group of people, and very honest to another; but at least with people, such stuff generally leaks all over.



Roman Empire? Civis Romanis sum and all that. You have to not use modern standards of "treated well" and note that not every resident was a citizen and some were slaves.


Yeah, that may have started out with somewhat noble intentions. But still:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fall_of_the_Western_Roman_Empir...

The legal fiction of the early Empire (in which the emperor was but the first among equals) was disposed of; the emperors, beginning with Aurelian, openly styled themselves as dominus et deus, lord and god, titles appropriate for a slave towards his master. An elaborate court ceremonial was developed, and obsequious flattery became the order of the day. Under Diocletian, the flow of direct requests to the emperor was rapidly reduced and soon ceased altogether. No other form of direct access replaced them, and the emperor received only information that was filtered through his courtiers.

Official cruelty, supporting extortion and corruption, may also have become more commonplace. While the scale, complexity, and violence of government were unmatched, the emperors lost control over their whole realm insofar as that control came increasingly to be wielded by anyone who paid for it. Meanwhile the richest senatorial families, immune from most taxation, engrossed more and more of the available wealth and income, while also becoming divorced from any tradition of military excellence.


It was a genuine question. I would like a genuine answer.




Guidelines | FAQ | Lists | API | Security | Legal | Apply to YC | Contact

Search: